Episode 2: Dr Steve Todd & Cesare Saguato
The Meta-Crisis: Science, Buddhism and Meaning
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What happens when the stories we’ve relied on to make sense of the world no longer work and certainty itself starts to feel like part of the problem?
In Episode 2 of The Bardo Podcast, comedian Marc Salmon is joined by theoretical physicist Dr Steve Todd and psychotherapist Cesare Saguato for a wide-ranging conversation about the meta-crisis: the overlapping crises of meaning, ecology, politics, and mental health shaping modern life.
Drawing on Tibetan Buddhism, physics, psychotherapy, meta-modern philosophy, and Western esotericism, the conversation explores how rigid worldviews collapse into despair and how uncertainty, plurality, and play might open up new ways of relating to ourselves and the world. Rather than searching for definitive answers, this episode stays with ambiguity, groundlessness, and the possibility of re-enchantment.
Topics include:
The meta-crisis and why modern solutions no longer seem to work
Meta-modernism and the idea of ironic sincerity
Buddhism, groundlessness, and living without fixed narratives
Science, magic, and the limits of a mechanistic worldview
Decentralised action, rhizomes, and collective change without blueprints
Activism as inner and outer transformation rather than opposition
Re-enchantment, play, and finding agency in uncertain times
Guests
Dr Steve Todd is a theoretical physicist with a PhD in high-energy particle theory and a long-time Buddhist practitioner within the Drukpa Kagyu tradition. His work explores the intersections of science, Buddhism, meta-modernism, and Western esotericism.
Steve’s Meta-Modern Rosicrucian group
Cesare Saguato is a Buddhist practitioner, psychotherapist, mindfulness teacher, and clinical supervisor. He works across private practice, education, and organisational settings, and is Chair of Bodhicharya UK.
Cesare’s work:
Mindful therapy
Bodhicharya Kent
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Music by Marc Salmon and Robert Fuller
Artwork by Zoe Brownstone
